00:00:00 --- log: started osdev/02.12.06 00:01:53 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 00:09:36 --- quit: malenfant (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00:13:07 i need to order some books 00:13:14 someday hmm 00:13:22 * geist buys a plane ticket 00:13:37 and i want freebsd 5.0!!! 00:13:45 still 14 days... *grr* 00:13:49 or 9 00:13:52 whatever 00:15:12 9 days 00:24:46 --- quit: darkito ("irc.homelien.no") 00:26:06 --- join: darkito (darkito@80-25-82-102.uc.nombres.ttd.es) joined #osdev 00:27:10 hihi 00:35:51 yo yo yo 00:35:58 hi geist :) 00:50:03 * geist goes to slee 00:50:05 sleep even 00:50:07 later 00:50:09 --- nick: geist -> geist-sleep 00:53:30 bbl exam time, wish me luck people i need it! 01:01:06 --- join: miro (~miro@picknicker.codeon.de) joined #osdev 01:03:56 --- quit: air (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01:08:03 --- quit: trans (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01:08:10 --- join: air- (~brand@12-254-199-50.client.attbi.com) joined #osdev 01:48:35 --- quit: miro (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 01:53:31 --- join: Mathis (~Mathis@manz-d9b95668.pool.mediaWays.net) joined #osdev 01:55:23 --- quit: Mathis (Client Quit) 02:36:31 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 02:43:38 --- nick: lynx_school -> lynx 03:33:25 --- quit: trans (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03:45:07 --- quit: file (Killed (NickServ (Ghost: file[chimera]!jwired@mctn1-1627.nb.aliant.net))) 03:45:16 --- join: file (jwired@mctn1-1627.nb.aliant.net) joined #osdev 04:27:32 boe. 04:27:55 LIESBETH IS STAYING WITH DAX! 04:44:11 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 04:53:41 --- join: Kurt (~kmw@gc-nas-01-s42.cinergycom.net) joined #osdev 05:07:25 --- quit: Kurt ("Connection reset by deer") 05:25:23 --- quit: trans (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 05:27:09 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 05:44:31 --- quit: n0vice ("I like core dumps") 05:47:33 --- join: miro (~miro@picknicker.codeon.de) joined #osdev 05:49:55 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 06:05:19 --- join: zhware (~stoyan@pddbae8.osakac00.ap.so-net.ne.jp) joined #osdev 06:11:28 --- quit: miro (Remote closed the connection) 06:20:02 --- quit: n0vice ("I like core dumps") 06:20:05 --- join: lala (htjonhigfg@p508FD270.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #osdev 06:20:44 --- nick: lala -> lodda 06:22:37 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 06:25:52 --- quit: zhware ("Client Exiting") 06:34:04 --- join: quantis (~darth@cg166.halls.umist.ac.uk) joined #osdev 06:34:54 --- quit: n0vice ("I like core dumps") 06:41:55 --- join: EtherNet (~UPP@200-41-33-123-tntteco1.dial-up.net.ar) joined #osdev 06:41:56 hello 06:43:02 --- quit: EtherNet (Client Quit) 06:43:55 air:http://autopackage.org/ 06:44:06 oh guess you away 06:51:41 --- join: beefcommando (~beefcomma@spkdsl-116-101.cet.com) joined #osdev 06:54:14 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 06:57:59 --- quit: quantis (Remote closed the connection) 07:08:10 --- join: zwane (User-10391@modemcable092.130-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.ca) joined #osdev 07:25:34 --- join: muphicks (~Gazza@earthforce.freeserve.co.uk) joined #osdev 07:34:05 --- quit: trans (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 08:36:12 --- join: quantis (~darth@cg166.halls.umist.ac.uk) joined #osdev 08:36:45 --- join: EtherNet (~UPP@200-41-33-156-tntteco1.dial-up.net.ar) joined #osdev 08:36:49 hello 08:37:27 ello there 08:37:45 hows uou 08:39:13 fine! and you ? 08:41:25 seemed to have pulled a muscle in my chest but other then that im fine 08:42:28 :( 08:43:19 cripplequantis ?! 08:47:40 fraid so 08:47:50 didint get to sleep this morning till my alarm went off :( 08:49:42 The trouble is, and have you heard of companies employing their own "Directors of Linux Kernel Engineering"? It reminds me of a DEC story. Ken Olsen used to give a turkey every Christmas to every employee. And when the company got to 70,000 employees someone came to him and said, why don't we have a turkey farm? Why don't we vertically integrate it all? 08:49:44 hahaha 08:49:53 sorry 08:49:59 im easily amused at the moment 08:52:41 silly :P 08:55:13 --- quit: EtherNet (":::: ( UPP ) ::::") 08:58:45 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 08:59:05 --- join: Dokam (dokam@195-57-79-166.uc.nombres.ttd.es) joined #osdev 08:59:10 hi 08:59:16 i am working without libc (in linux) 08:59:23 (and in asm) 08:59:30 dont tell me your using lfs .... 08:59:44 how can i catch the errno var which is set by the syscalls? 09:04:15 can www.linuxassembly.org not help ? 09:05:06 --- quit: n0vice ("I like core dumps") 09:06:06 i'm afraid not 09:06:14 hmmmph 09:06:22 what are you doing this for ? 09:07:10 just learning 09:07:22 i'm doing a tiny http server 09:07:29 without any others libs 09:07:33 in asm!!!! 09:07:37 yes 09:07:43 maniac... 09:07:55 impressive indeed 09:08:00 but still you are a manic.. 09:08:11 hehe 09:08:43 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 09:26:34 --- nick: geist-sleep -> geist 09:27:10 Morning. 09:27:55 yo 09:35:04 hey 09:35:06 --- quit: trans (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 09:35:09 bye 09:38:10 i is back. 09:39:43 ello dax, geist,rico 09:39:50 geist: howd the bike go 09:39:59 great 09:40:06 that was just the classroom part of it 09:40:14 we'll start riding this weekend 09:40:26 yay 09:40:39 don't ride off a cliff 09:40:40 I should do totally fine. I used to ride dirtbikes at a friends house when I was a kid 09:41:05 ahh , so were not going to see you in here with like a broken arm or neck or anything :) 09:41:20 probably not 09:41:21 geist: if you die, can I take over newos? >:D 09:41:28 you can do it now if you want 09:41:30 it's open source 09:42:07 can I kill you too? 09:42:11 please? 09:42:15 gesit: do you know if theres any reason why gcc 3.2 would break multiboot kernels that seemed to work in 2.95 09:42:28 Rco: why so morbid 09:42:31 probably some layout issue 09:42:35 dunno 09:42:41 any c++ in the kernel? 09:42:42 * quantis goes loads his sa80, just in case ... 09:43:03 geist: some possibly, most not 09:43:09 ive tried it with a few 09:43:13 are there any unresolved externals? 09:43:33 it may have changed the hidden functions it calls as part of the c++ runtime 09:43:55 but some of them only have a c based printf in them :( 09:44:00 though linked against a proper libgcc, it should still be okay 09:44:11 but I've seen it emit calls to all sorts of stuff when dealing with libs 09:44:28 really? but it should be tring to link them to anything 09:44:32 anyway, I dunno. I stay away from 3.2 for now 09:44:46 what version are the newos tools ? 09:44:52 it can emit calls that you're expected to provide in your libc 09:44:56 3.0.4 09:45:07 hmm might give that one a whirl then 09:45:20 I know for a fact that newos doesn't compile on 3.2 right now 09:45:26 well, it doesn't link actually 09:45:35 nothing seems to 09:45:42 the linking could be the problem 09:45:43 it ends up with a couple of new unresolved externals, but I dont care about it right now 09:45:56 cause grub always seems to say kernel to large to fit in memory 09:46:11 probably has a section at 0000:0000 or soemthing :( 09:46:14 I have only a vague understanding of what grub does exactly, so I'm not really sure 09:46:18 k 09:46:31 hmm grub compatiable newos... 09:46:58 oh II'm sure it can be done, but I dont want to waste my time with it 09:47:01 i should stop thinking 09:47:09 if i stop thinking i might do some work 09:49:21 that's an idea 09:49:37 the most productive os coders are the ones that dont spend all their time onirc 09:49:46 yeah 09:50:10 was going to offer my root account password to the first person to delete xhat from my system... 09:50:21 but then it occcured to me how they might delete it... 09:50:44 right 09:51:25 not going to be on much until after christmat though 09:52:55 --- join: buffer (~f4ack@nwlnmnnas02-pool0-a208.nwlnmn.tds.net) joined #osdev 09:53:38 --- quit: geist (forward.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 09:58:54 --- join: damieng-g4 (~damieng@user111.res2-fi2.jtibs.net) joined #osdev 09:59:11 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 09:59:11 --- join: geist (~geist@tkgeisel.com) joined #osdev 09:59:27 got a lot of coding done ? 10:00:14 wow my speakers a rea realy ficked up, making nin sound even weirder tehn normally 10:07:26 buy new ones? 10:07:30 decent ones? 10:07:43 would do 10:07:52 but the whole stero systems only about £70 10:08:10 got it for christmas a couple of years ago :( cant afford new ones 10:08:45 besides it sounds cool now,, cause some of the frequencies dont see, to be working write, some of the lyrics seemed garbled :) 10:09:42 you can't expect decent quality for £70 10:09:50 i take you aren't an audiophile? 10:09:51 yeah i know.. 10:09:54 i am 10:10:00 just not one with lots of money 10:10:04 ah 10:10:05 hmm 10:10:28 save some money and invest in a nice accuphase amp, sony cd player and b&w speakers? 10:10:36 and maybe add a pro-ject turntable 10:10:37 :D 10:10:51 dont have any vinyal 10:11:00 brb 10:11:02 !!! 10:17:45 --- quit: damieng-g4 (Remote closed the connection) 10:17:52 --- join: damieng-g4 (~damieng@user111.res2-fi2.jtibs.net) joined #osdev 10:18:16 FFX OWNS 10:19:34 --- quit: zwane (Excess Flood) 10:19:48 --- join: zwane (User-10391@modemcable092.130-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.ca) joined #osdev 10:20:14 * geist goes to work 10:20:22 have fun 10:20:22 bye geisti 10:22:47 --- quit: darkito ("damn! loads of... sad?") 10:29:32 --- quit: n0vice ("I like core dumps") 10:30:05 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 10:34:54 hi n0vice 10:34:57 hey 10:35:00 whats up 10:35:02 how is you 10:35:14 truely a novice, for a 1337 h4x0r would write n0v1c3 :D 10:35:39 lol i just do that to throw people off 10:35:52 i like it when people underestimate my mad skill 10:35:58 :) 10:36:15 good answer... 10:36:39 hey wow...this dude in #asm made me feel alot less like a newbie 10:36:49 how's that 10:36:56 he asked how to spell assembly 10:37:02 im past that stage lol 10:37:09 that isn't a noob question 10:37:15 i can't spell worth shit either 10:37:20 lol shut up 10:37:24 it's asm 10:37:59 god this is annoying 10:38:04 what is? 10:38:16 trying to get half life to work 10:38:42 it works fine not in desktop mode but i want it to be in desktop mode...and its laggy as hell in desktop mode 10:38:48 sounds and video suck in it 10:39:35 under linsucks? freebsd? openbsd? netbsd? 10:39:40 crapdows? 10:39:57 macosX? 10:40:02 yes im using wine to run half life in windows 10:40:02 muhahahaha.... 10:40:19 ah never said you were using wine did ya? 10:40:32 desktop mode and stuff...that implies wine 10:40:33 lol 10:40:38 gentoo 10:40:41 the best distro 10:40:45 no way. 10:40:49 jey theres an idea... wine on cygwin...on windows... probably be more stable 10:40:49 yes wat 10:40:51 way* 10:41:04 have you tried wineX? 10:41:06 i would prefer giving it a "worst distro" reward 10:41:08 quantis: lol, not really 10:41:14 as much as i love linux 10:41:17 its got full directX support 10:41:24 wine still doesnt got directx down pat 10:41:27 its just a games version of wine 10:41:40 www.transgaming.com 10:41:43 menus load slow in most games and random errors here and there 10:41:55 im running the current stable release of winex 10:41:59 ahh 10:42:01 k 10:42:06 i dunno havent tried it yet not had time 10:42:13 use crapdows if you can't live without games 10:42:20 i'll stick to freebsd & tuxracer. 10:42:23 nah buy an xbox 10:42:36 then at least microsoft is paying you for the windows license... 10:42:38 nah pc games own console games 10:43:48 not all 10:44:07 yet to see pc games even match those good ol' snes games :D 10:44:07 1st person shooters, and strategy games 10:44:26 not like fighting combat games, and mario style games 10:44:34 SoM 1 to 3, FF 5 & 6 10:44:45 SoM? 10:44:49 omg 10:45:01 guess i'll slip that remark because of your nick :) 10:45:05 secret of mana 10:45:17 rigghhhttt 10:45:21 that game sounds awesome 10:45:34 it does? 10:45:39 no 10:45:50 the graphics are amazing 10:45:58 what the hell was is it ? azelda type game 10:46:12 yea, zelda/ff kinda 10:46:16 zelda was good too 10:46:36 yea 10:46:42 brb gatta restart x 10:46:51 --- quit: n0vice ("I like core dumps") 10:47:08 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 10:47:40 ok i think my dns server is fubar. 10:47:45 back 10:48:31 how come dax? 10:48:52 dax :you have ffx ? 10:49:01 no i quit playing ff at 8 10:49:12 well 10:49:21 what do you want to say by that? 10:49:22 quantis: some kid at my isp fell over the power plug? 10:49:34 lynx: that i didn't play ff9 and ff10 10:49:37 no reason really 10:50:38 i have a ? about os design...i want to get on the right track on what to learn about c/c++...not like skip anything but like what to concentrate on to be able to program my own kernel... 10:51:01 what kind of stuff should i read/ 10:51:32 bout os design? so pure theory? 10:51:44 no about c/c++ programmin 10:51:45 g 10:51:48 oh 10:51:50 programming* 10:51:56 you know c/c++? 10:52:36 or do you still have to learn it? 10:52:36 j00 r teh basic programmer 10:52:59 i know the concepts and syntax, but because i have nothing to work on im sure im horrible at applying them...and i dont know all the library functions i can use 10:53:34 hmm this would be easier if i could get to amazon.com 10:53:43 like ive read about printf,scanf, data types, cout, cin, i can use control structures and loops well, pointers, structs, unions... 10:53:44 how about... The C Programming Language ? 10:53:58 --- join: Schutsch (Schutsch@pD9E7FE7F.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #osdev 10:53:58 and Effective C++ 10:54:04 or something like that 10:54:09 i have books on c++ 10:54:21 and c 10:54:24 id recommend c to start with 10:54:27 and Linux Programming 10:54:33 takes a bit of work to get c++ working 10:54:49 doesn't matter if you start with C or C++ 10:54:50 and you cant write the whole of you kernel in it 10:54:55 i just dont get how to program a kernel...like its not like you can use any librarys can you? 10:55:14 n0vice: ah so you're looking for a book about the implementation of a kernel? 10:55:24 --- join: Wolf[oma] (BadWolf@A4eab.pppool.de) joined #osdev 10:55:29 tanenbaum has a nice one like that about Minix 10:55:30 hehe 10:55:34 can't recall the title though 10:55:37 http://my.execpc.com/~geezer/osd/ 10:55:51 os design & implementation? 10:55:57 kind of...i just want to know about programming an os lol..like i dont get how kernels work...im a newb at all this 10:56:01 dunno i have his Modern OS Design, it's pretty nice 10:56:04 dax:operating system design and implmentation by A. WoodHall and A. Tanenbaum 10:56:07 but pure theorty 10:56:12 -t 10:56:19 quantis: yes that one 10:56:23 i can get the isbn as well if you want :) 10:56:27 had for about year and half 10:56:39 --- join: zensox (~zensox@p5085BD7B.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #osdev 10:56:49 i haven't read that book though, so i can't say if it's a good one or not 10:56:55 i got the dinosaurs one as well 10:57:05 oh that one 10:57:17 dax, noovice: its nto a bad book, but minix isnt the best thought out os in the world 10:57:22 i want the dragon one! looks interesting 10:57:23 yea but i dont want neccisarily all theory yet..i want to know a little about programming 10:57:38 and the book does concentrate largely on the theory that makes sense with relation ot minix 10:57:45 quantis: true, but it was made to teach about the implementation of a basic os, it's pretty decent on that afaik 10:57:56 well half the book is just listing coe for most of the kernel 10:58:01 yeah i like it 10:58:22 n0vice: the theory is the fun part! 10:58:30 and the hard part 10:58:32 liked it so much when i got, the pages stranglely started to stick together like a porn mag... 10:58:50 I have the dinosaur and the dragon book 10:58:53 id say getting a kernel to fuckign compiles the hard part 10:59:01 dragons for compilers isnt it ? 10:59:03 Rico: gimme the dragon one 10:59:05 like this code in an example of a site i was at..how the hell does this work to print hello world on the screen? 10:59:06 yes 10:59:06 i got both tthem as well 10:59:07 int main(void) 10:59:07 { 10:59:07 char *str = "Hello, world", *ch; 10:59:07 unsigned short *vidmem = (unsigned short*) 0xb8000; 10:59:07 unsigned i; 10:59:10 quantis: yes 10:59:11 for (ch = str, i = 0; *ch; ch++, i++) 10:59:13 vidmem[i] = (unsigned char) *ch | 0x0700; 10:59:15 for (;;) 10:59:17 ; 10:59:19 } 10:59:32 i liketh dinasaurs book 10:59:32 sorry for the flood, didnt realize how many lines it was 10:59:46 think it makes more sendse then the tannabayum one on theory 10:59:49 right i got to go 10:59:50 0xB8000 is the vid memory, just write char + attribute to that 10:59:58 im living in a ditch for the weekend yeah!!!! :) 10:59:59 but I still want more books on osdev and another one at compiler design. 11:00:04 quantis: the modern os design one is nice though 11:00:05 cya all soon 11:00:06 dax: ? 11:00:23 the dragon book is highly technical, a bit too high 11:00:24 Rico, get a book on lex and yacc makes compiler design so so much easier... 11:00:41 not that ive ever actually made any code... that would just spoil my reputation... 11:00:47 dax: how do you know that that is video memory? 11:00:51 quantis: same here 11:01:02 yeah tell me about, but it was easier then my bloody lectures notes on the subject 11:01:03 n0vice: 0xb800 is fixed 11:01:17 got a new on the other dya that has stuff about object oriented compiler implmentation 11:01:34 I'd also like "The Handbook Of Applied Cryptography" and "Applied Cryptography" 11:01:35 dax: that like what im talking about..where to learn that kind of stuff 11:01:40 havent got time to get details i got to be at barracks in an hour 11:01:46 not big on cryptography 11:01:47 n0vice: not in books heh 11:01:55 dax: where? 11:02:09 reading about BIOS? 11:02:12 or something 11:02:16 theres a book called murtl v1.0 its tells you about writting a 32 bit os in asm/c 11:02:16 n0vice: no idea, i picked it up while i was getting into graphics stuff 11:02:20 which is a few years ago 11:02:21 at my school they sell some books on programming languages. 11:02:22 its the only real book of its kind 11:02:27 and i have an awful bad memory 11:02:32 bye 11:02:34 but...books are always so goddamn expensive! 11:02:34 --- quit: quantis ("Client Exiting") 11:02:36 i have written a OS in 32-bit 11:02:40 anyone like to test it ? 11:02:41 else i'd have a big bookshelf 11:03:08 i have a fully working 32 bit microkernel that is roughly equal in terms of performance to l4ka... take that :D 11:03:26 w/e for now ill stick to programming...anyone got any ideas for a programming project i can try for excercise (not os related)....in a newb remember....like something that you need pointers for..because i need practise using them lol 11:03:39 does it have virtual memory? no? haha, sucker! 11:03:48 who needs 11:03:50 n0vice: hmm... do something that interests you 11:03:55 simple to implement 11:03:57 by a driver 11:04:04 dax: like what...i cant program anything id actually use lol 11:04:07 virtual memory... bah... just add a server 11:04:26 n0vice: hmm how about graphics stuff? www.gamedev.net and www.flipcode.net 11:04:32 and who needs it if more than 256 Mb ? 11:04:48 Schutsch: uhm 256mb isn't enough. 11:04:55 dax: does gamedev talk about linux related graphics stuff? 11:05:08 n0vice: just stick to opengl and you should be fine 11:05:12 nehe.gamedev.net 11:05:17 dax: nvm lol i feel like an idiot..it was on thte main page 11:05:24 "linux development" 11:05:28 :) 11:08:43 n0vice: GBA development is nice too 11:08:56 yes it is, or atleast it apears to be 11:09:05 maybe i should port daxos to it? 11:09:30 wjat is GBA? 11:09:43 gameboyadvance 11:09:49 gameboy advance 11:09:58 damn i died in ffx :/ 11:10:31 the gba doesn't have a mmu, but since you don't use it...hell yeah! 11:11:06 i dont think you guys realise how bad i am at programming lol 11:11:11 Rico : u do gbadev? 11:11:20 well you said you were pretty decent 11:11:29 Rico: i do use an mmu. 11:11:43 everyone does 11:11:51 everyone do 11:11:55 sorry (german) 11:12:03 does was correct 11:12:08 ? 11:12:10 he does 11:12:13 you do ? 11:12:15 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 11:12:16 ok 11:12:16 ye 11:12:22 everyone does 11:12:36 yea although my english is lousy too :( 11:12:38 what opengl header files do i use? 11:12:55 GL/gl.h 11:13:00 GL/glu.h 11:13:04 GL/glaux.h 11:13:17 and uhm that's about all you'll need until you start using extensions 11:13:26 "/usr/X11R6/include/GL/" "/usr/lib/opengl/nvidia/include/gl.h" 11:13:29 lynx: not yet 11:13:40 oh i just put #include ? 11:13:48 but I've been reading some stuff about it lately 11:13:59 seems pretty interesting 11:14:07 n0vice: yes 11:14:26 Titanium ports # ping www.slashdot.org 11:14:26 ping: cannot resolve www.slashdot.org: Unknown host 11:14:29 grrr 11:14:50 and on the nehe lessons...which code should i download...the linux version..Linux/GLX..or Linux/SDL 11:15:01 sdl ones 11:15:11 sdl is easier 11:15:14 Titanium ports # ping osnews.com 11:15:14 ping: cannot resolve osnews.com: Unknown host 11:15:17 GRRR. 11:15:22 haha 11:15:25 oh...what is the diff? 11:15:26 dax sucks ;) 11:15:36 Rico: no, planetinternet sucks 11:19:42 that too 11:19:54 do you have KPN over there? 11:20:03 telephone company? 11:22:21 no kpn 11:22:24 kpn sucks 11:22:28 we got belgacom. 11:22:35 belgacom kinda sucks 11:23:09 can anyone gimme the ip of osnews ? 11:23:50 --- join: ASau (~asau@158.250.48.197) joined #osdev 11:24:05 osnews.com? 11:24:37 damn, the ip of goatse.cx doesn't refer to goatse.cx :( 11:24:37 jw, is there a command to just get the ip...i usually ping it to get the ip 11:24:42 almost got ya there... 11:29:17 ... 11:29:33 ping osnews.com or someting like that and copy the ip over her eplease 11:30:42 208.186.180.200 11:30:49 thx 11:31:01 bah 11:31:08 Zayda Internet? 11:31:10 zayda 11:31:12 :( 11:33:09 i need a working nameserver grr 11:35:49 that really sucks 11:35:52 lol 11:36:24 god this opengl stuff is hard lol 11:36:54 yes in the begin it's hard 11:38:11 do you just remember every function? 11:38:19 it's easier than surfin the net without a dns 11:38:34 uhm you remember a few and you keep a reference manual somewere 11:38:35 or man pages 11:38:42 maybe there are manpages about it 11:39:27 oh...do you keep a reference manual near you? 11:40:13 you can find online ones 11:40:17 which are useful 11:40:26 that is, IF YOUR DNS WORKS. 11:40:30 and what is SDL? and how does it compare to GLX..and without either 11:40:51 sdl... www.libsdl.org 11:40:52 dax: i could create a user on my comp so you could log in and ping all the sites you want...but youd have to tell me how lol 11:41:13 hmm nah i'll wait until they put the plug back in 11:41:21 ok 11:41:53 hmm maybe i'm gonna switch to another dns 11:41:53 wait 11:44:48 ok 11:44:57 hi all 11:46:16 hey 11:46:22 haha i can't get to my modem 11:46:31 hmm 11:46:35 weird 11:48:32 --- quit: damieng-g4 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11:50:41 dax: what kind of connection are you on? 11:51:07 seriel patch 11:55:30 --- quit: file (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 11:57:32 --- join: file (jwired@mctn1-0298.nb.aliant.net) joined #osdev 11:57:56 n0vice: 1mbps adsl 11:58:01 soon to be 3mbps adsl 11:58:09 BLEH 11:58:13 where ? 11:58:15 3mbps 11:58:20 * file already has 2mbps 11:58:21 here is 1.5 max 11:58:29 well - since I'm farther I only get 1.4mbps 11:58:32 well i get a free upgrade to 3mbps 11:58:39 and i'm prolly close enough to get 8mbps 11:59:21 Schutsch: belgium :) 11:59:33 we get cheap broadband around here 11:59:54 i can't check prices, cause i can't do shit without a dns 12:00:38 * file can lookup IP addresses for you 12:00:59 could you give me osdev.com and overclockers.com ? 12:01:34 216.244.108.52 and 208.249.124.215 12:02:09 thanks 12:02:24 oh damn 12:02:29 just 5 secs too late i suppose 12:02:31 dns is back 12:02:35 :) 12:05:02 --- quit: Wolf[oma] (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 12:09:19 --- join: gianluca (~kernel@ppp-171-136.28-151.libero.it) joined #osdev 12:09:39 hello 12:14:29 --- quit: file (Killed (NickServ (Ghost: file[livingroom]!~lan@mctn1-4051.nb.aliant.net))) 12:14:39 --- join: file (~lan@mctn1-4051.nb.aliant.net) joined #osdev 12:17:51 --- part: ASau left #osdev 12:32:30 --- join: pavlovski (TimRobinso@modem-1880.cheetah.dialup.pol.co.uk) joined #osdev 12:32:44 hi all 12:33:15 pavlovski: ! 12:33:19 -: 12:34:18 :D 12:34:34 back to reading about sdl and opengl 12:34:36 woo hoo 12:34:43 heh 12:35:07 dax: what does SDL_Surface *surface; do? 12:35:15 it's a surface 12:35:23 something to blit on 12:35:25 put pixels on 12:35:27 etc etc 12:35:27 like what is the struct and whats the surface used for 12:35:34 oh ok thanks 12:35:35 --- join: do (~daemon@194.85.84.244) joined #osdev 12:35:51 http://www.libsdl.org/tutorials.php 12:36:13 sup? 12:36:13 yea i looked there...im reading the nehe ones 12:36:39 --- quit: do (Client Quit) 12:36:43 --- join: do (~daemon@194.85.84.244) joined #osdev 12:36:56 omg 12:37:00 guess what I just found 12:37:14 a $0.01 whore? 12:37:33 your genitalia? 12:37:38 nope 12:37:45 somebody sent Santa Claus a letter via Fedex 2-day letter 12:37:49 http://www.fedex.com/cgi-bin/tracking?tracknumbers=833988606387&action=track&language=english&cntry_code=us&mps=y 12:37:52 there's the tracking information 12:38:05 the dildo your parents bought you for xmas? 12:38:05 oh 12:39:50 --- join: Mathis (~Mathis@manz-d9b95075.pool.mediaWays.net) joined #osdev 12:40:15 hiyall 12:40:31 what happens if you just exit without doing SDL_Quit();? 12:40:49 hi Mathis 12:49:45 brb 12:50:05 --- quit: trans (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12:53:11 --- quit: gianluca (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12:55:58 where is sleep- 13:02:58 sleepin i supose 13:03:02 AHAHA THE HUMOR 13:03:19 n0vice: SDL doesn't get cleaned then, bad thing i suppose 13:15:02 --- quit: n0vice ("I like core dumps") 13:16:17 --- quit: file (Killed (NickServ (Ghost: file[livingroom]!~lan@mctn1-1627.nb.aliant.net))) 13:16:28 --- join: file (~lan@mctn1-1627.nb.aliant.net) joined #osdev 13:21:21 --- join: nwertman (~nwertman@199.45.143.226) joined #osdev 13:21:47 hey all...I have some os development questions. Does anyone have a moment to help a new guy? 13:23:04 I am runnin bochs under OSX. I would like to boot a simple (very simple) kernel. I need to cross compile the source, then assemble it, link it, then get it onto a disk image file....how do I do this? (pretty vague I know) 13:23:51 first thing first though....how do I cross compile and link a kernel for x86 on ppc hardware? 13:23:59 --- join: Kurt (~kmw@gc-nas-01-s115.cinergycom.net) joined #osdev 13:24:12 get an x86 compiler? 13:24:35 gcc is installed...it is supposed to work as a cross compiler correct? 13:26:48 not necessarily 13:27:05 do gcc -dumpmachine and see what it says 13:27:12 k... 13:27:37 only ppc-darwin...I would need to recompile it to support x86 then 13:27:48 how about the assembler and linker 13:27:49 ? 13:27:58 same there 13:28:05 although it's probably a different command line option 13:28:06 hang on 13:28:54 hmm... 13:29:16 unless you can find a precompiled x86 gcc/binutils for PPC+OSX, you might need to reconfigure and recompile 13:30:01 that is no problem...I am fairly computer savy just not with cross platform development 13:30:29 k, I've never had to cross compile so that's the only advice I can give until you get the compiler :) 13:37:40 --- join: minddog (~minddog@ip68-98-85-105.ph.ph.cox.net) joined #osdev 13:37:50 dudes 13:39:29 --- join: wossname (wossname@HSE-QuebecCity-ppp81313.qc.sympatico.ca) joined #osdev 13:39:29 hey file 13:39:40 hey lynx! 13:39:43 Hey lynxie & file & woss! 13:39:47 Hey pavlovski 13:40:03 bloop 13:40:21 hey wossname and Robert! 13:42:19 yo peeps, what's up? 13:52:18 yo pavlovski ! 13:52:22 sup honey? 13:52:29 * lynx is coding 13:52:33 --- join: rakbladet (johan@h200n3c1o254.bredband.skanova.com) joined #osdev 13:53:16 * Robert skär sig. 13:56:57 * pavlovski too 13:57:12 I'm writing a program that will email you stuff from newsgroups 13:57:22 an NNTP-email gateway 13:58:24 --- join: jsr (www@du-13-236.ppp.telenordia.se) joined #osdev 13:59:35 also, I'm getting ADSL on Tuesday 13:59:40 congrats 13:59:41 what speed? 14:00:05 pavlovski: Nice :) 14:00:07 --- join: zwane_ (User-10392@modemcable092.130-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.ca) joined #osdev 14:00:21 file: 512/256 14:00:30 well, more like 300 14:00:31 pavlovski: better than nothing 14:00:59 better than 56 :) 14:01:25 I'm getting a DSL modem with an Ethernet interface so hopefully I won't get hax0red too much 14:11:46 --- join: tirloni (gpt@1-151.mganm700-1.telepar.net.br) joined #osdev 14:13:18 --- join: Aardappel (wvo96r@p508C546F.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #osdev 14:17:04 --- quit: zwane (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14:18:23 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 14:18:31 --- quit: gab (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 14:19:12 --- join: gab (~prfalken@gaia.chx-labs.org) joined #osdev 14:19:27 --- quit: lodda (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14:22:18 --- quit: beefcommando (Remote closed the connection) 14:22:41 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 14:22:46 --- join: n0vice_ (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 14:23:06 --- quit: n0vice_ (Client Quit) 14:23:06 --- quit: n0vice (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 14:23:07 --- join: n0vice_ (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 14:30:04 --- quit: buffer (Remote closed the connection) 14:34:18 --- quit: n0vice_ ("I like core dumps") 14:34:41 --- join: beefcommando (~beefcomma@spkdsl-116-101.cet.com) joined #osdev 14:42:35 --- quit: Kurt ("Connection reset by fear") 14:51:53 --- quit: jsr (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14:52:44 --- quit: pavlovski (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15:04:41 --- quit: HeavyJoost ("Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)") 15:10:29 --- join: HeavyJoost (~HeavyJoos@a213-84-139-110.adsl.xs4all.nl) joined #osdev 15:25:14 --- quit: beefcommando (Remote closed the connection) 15:34:11 blargh and fooie 15:37:28 --- join: jcopenha (~jcopenha@6532148hfc96.tampabay.rr.com) joined #osdev 15:41:31 hey all... 15:41:39 Hi. 15:42:57 I am now compiling gcc3 with the option --target=i386-linux will this allow me to compile software on my mac to be run on the x86? I am worried mainly about the linker and assembler stages...I got nasm to compile though so I am mainly worried about the ld linker....will it work? 15:43:07 or do I need to find another linker? 15:46:55 how will you run it on your x86? you mean your os or on linux or something? 15:47:34 otherwise basically yes 15:47:40 though you also need to build binutils 15:47:51 which is a package of a bunch of other tools (including ld) 15:48:16 build binutils first, with --target=i386-linux --prefix=/usr/local/i386-linux 15:48:18 or i386-elf 15:48:29 then add /usr/local/i386-linux/bin to your path 15:48:35 then ./configure gcc with 15:49:01 --prefix=/usr/local/i386-linux --target=i386-linux --with-newlib --enable-languages=c,c++ 15:49:14 then do 'make -k' because it wont be able to build all of the newlib 15:49:31 (stdc++ it can't build until you give it a set of libc headers for it to link against) 15:49:39 --- join: n0vice (~n0vice@pcp02102499pcs.towson01.md.comcast.net) joined #osdev 15:49:56 if you want to cross-compile to a particular os target, it's a bit more complicated and I've never personally done it 15:50:27 ie, if you want to be able to build a binary that will run directly on a linux box, because you have to provide the libs and the includes of linux to link against 15:50:45 which is what you'ld essentially do if you build your own os, it's just a lot simpler 15:50:52 does that answer your question? 15:53:38 --- quit: rakbladet () 16:04:05 --- join: gianluca (~kernel@ppp-190-132.28-151.libero.it) joined #osdev 16:05:29 hi there 16:07:46 --- quit: jcopenha (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 16:10:11 --- quit: gianluca ("ircII EPIC4-1.1.7 -- Are we there yet?") 16:12:49 * do is away: sleeping 16:12:52 --- nick: do -> do[done] 16:13:21 dax: you here? 16:18:55 guess not 16:27:11 --- quit: muphicks ("Client Exiting") 16:27:27 --- quit: nwertman (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 16:39:25 --- quit: Mathis ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby") 16:40:28 --- quit: Schutsch (Ping timeout: 14400 seconds) 16:50:20 --- quit: tirloni () 16:56:55 --- quit: trans (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17:03:20 --- quit: Rico (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 17:06:47 --- quit: Zenton ("Client Exiting") 17:07:22 --- join: Zenton (~vicente@8.Red-80-34-35.pooles.rima-tde.net) joined #osdev 17:32:41 --- join: zwane (User-10392@modemcable092.130-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.ca) joined #osdev 17:32:51 --- part: zwane left #osdev 17:39:15 . 17:39:37 , 17:48:43 ` 17:49:10 ' 17:50:13 aw wossname! the conversation started off so well, then you had to bring ' into it 17:50:19 kick ban him! 17:50:48 :'( 17:52:33 --- join: EtherNet (~Simpleirc@lu9dcn.ampr.org) joined #osdev 17:53:11 hello 17:53:11 everybody 17:53:59 hiIIII 17:54:22 26 people == half strength #osdev 17:59:12 --- join: eKIK (u443489@regulus2.student.UU.SE) joined #osdev 17:59:17 --- quit: EtherNet (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 18:00:16 well, the general level of quality of discussion has been terrible lately 18:00:25 I'd rather this channel stay quiet than full of crap 18:01:04 back! 18:01:52 such as "'"? 18:02:29 fair enough 18:02:41 I'm guilty as well 18:03:02 --- join: bwb (~bwb@ip68-4-124-131.oc.oc.cox.net) joined #osdev 18:03:12 I guess people just haven't been doing much osdev lately, or they're all busy actually devving and not ircing 18:03:15 Let's stay quiet then. And bore to death. 18:03:54 #osdev is where you hang about the few cool 7 or 8 actual developers and leech cool off of them 18:04:08 maybe half of the developers actually work ;D 18:04:18 right 18:04:29 so, if you want quality, you need a private channel. 18:04:37 with admission to those only with actual codebases 18:04:58 well, I dont see a problem with actual osdev chat, or even computer stuff 18:05:05 ...and become hated and called elitistic. 18:05:18 even asking questions to devs is fine 18:05:31 --- join: EtherNet_ (~Simpleirc@lu9dcn.ampr.org) joined #osdev 18:05:31 --- nick: EtherNet_ -> EtherNet 18:05:52 but it irritates the hell out of me personally at least when folks are sitting around chatting about shit that obviously has nothing to do with osdev or even programming or computers 18:06:13 humm, i have a question about OS... 18:06:22 I usually just drop off the channel because I get tired of reading stuff, looking for questions or actual interesting stuff 18:06:25 all i have in my log are technical discussions, aside from this last few minutes :) 18:06:27 what would be a good OS for video capturing and multimedia? 18:06:49 wossname: fine 18:06:51 --- part: geist left #osdev 18:06:53 hmm it appears that nothing has changed for the 8 months I havn't come in here heh 18:06:56 Zenton: BeOS or MacOS X ? 18:07:18 thanks gab. 18:07:26 are BSDs good for it? 18:07:38 low latency and such. 18:07:51 hmmm 18:07:57 --- part: EtherNet left #osdev 18:08:07 --- part: bwb left #osdev 18:08:09 there's quite a lack of good software for this on *BSD 18:08:29 but kernel would be suitable? 18:08:44 dunno 18:08:49 k. 18:09:00 thanks anyway. ;) 18:09:03 but personally I doubt it 18:09:18 (btw I can be wrong) 18:09:43 i will try and see. ;) 18:09:53 but for multimedia you'd better try BeOS 18:10:01 very low latency 18:10:12 it has some good tools for this kind of stuff 18:10:57 --- nick: Aardappel -> aard|zzz 18:10:58 oh. 18:11:04 seems cool then. 18:11:07 i will try. 18:15:59 --- join: malenfant (~malenfant@142.179.59.61) joined #osdev 18:21:50 --- quit: stormbind (Remote closed the connection) 18:28:00 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 18:36:13 --- join: jbreker (~jbreker@HSE-Ottawa-ppp237236.sympatico.ca) joined #osdev 18:45:10 --- quit: lynx (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 18:57:25 --- join: nwertman (~nwertman@12-253-122-29.client.attbi.com) joined #osdev 19:15:27 --- quit: trans (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19:19:42 --- quit: jbreker ("Client Exiting") 19:28:01 --- part: eKIK left #osdev 19:34:18 --- quit: nwertman (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19:36:51 --- quit: wossname ("yes, evening all..") 20:06:03 --- join: DorkPunk (rajiv@cs6625167-251.austin.rr.com) joined #osdev 20:07:37 My kernel is behaving quite strangely... 20:19:12 --- join: Ubel (~jonorn@arnarson.is) joined #osdev 20:27:29 nite all. 20:28:01 --- join: lynx (~lynx@p508091E8.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #osdev 20:29:58 hey lynx 20:30:09 --- quit: DorkPunk ("[BX] Reserve your copy of BitchX-1.0c19 for the Commodore 64 today!") 20:34:31 --- join: apuigsech (~apuigsech@80-24-12-216.uc.nombres.ttd.es) joined #osdev 20:35:05 hi apuigsech. ;) 20:35:22 :) 20:35:23 hi 20:38:41 --- join: buffer (~f4ack@nwlnmnnas02-pool0-a15.nwlnmn.tds.net) joined #osdev 20:45:42 --- join: trans (~trans@fatwire-201-211.uniserve.ca) joined #osdev 20:53:51 --- join: Stalky (~cms@ool-4353d3c2.dyn.optonline.net) joined #osdev 21:17:25 --- quit: buffer ("Client Exiting") 21:17:37 --- nick: air- -> air 21:17:43 --- join: malenfant_ (~malenfant@142.179.59.61) joined #osdev 21:18:24 --- quit: malenfant_ (Client Quit) 21:37:20 --- quit: Ubel ("Client Exiting") 22:21:36 --- join: dax__ (~dax@u212-239-164-73.adsl.pi.be) joined #osdev 22:31:36 * do[done] is back (gone 06:18:49) 22:31:39 --- nick: do[done] -> do 22:38:23 --- quit: dax (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 22:52:01 --- join: huntrckr (~huntrckr@myr53-01-p23.gt.saix.net) joined #osdev 22:52:09 moo 22:55:03 heh... typical... i havent been here for a week, and when i do finally join the chatroom, nobody is here :( 22:56:20 --- join: geist2 (~geist@dsl-65-191-44-105.telocity.com) joined #osdev 22:56:33 --- nick: geist2 -> geist 23:00:10 hi geist 23:00:15 sup 23:00:35 not much 23:00:44 been working out of town the whole week 23:00:49 you? 23:01:07 been pretty busy, got a lot of stuff done though 23:01:12 gonna hack on newos a bit 23:01:21 cleaning up the desk right now though 23:02:23 I'd like to fix an old crasher in newos that I've been unable to track down before 23:02:28 it'd be nice to get it totally taken care of 23:03:57 hmmm...yeah 23:04:06 but it's been hard to reproduce 23:04:24 and thus far not successful at reproducing under bochs (so I could trace it) 23:04:39 but I have another strategy I'm going to try tonight maybe 23:05:03 how can i get in x86 real mode the model of CPU? 23:05:16 cpuid doesn't work in real mode? 23:05:38 but not all CPUs have it 23:05:47 286 doen't i think 23:05:53 ah well, there's a procedure for figuring it out. 23:06:01 I've seen it written, lemme see 23:06:21 it's like 'try this, if it doesn't have it, it's a 486 or below' 'then try this' etc 23:06:44 one quest more... is cpuid usable on protectmode from ringX (x!=0)? 23:06:58 well, that's in the intel manual 23:07:19 i readed it (not all) 23:07:19 I think it is, or maybe it's a setting 23:07:39 aja.. thz a lot :) 23:08:02 i dont know if get cpu model after jump to protect mode or not 23:08:03 hehehe 23:08:20 cpuid is available in all rings it appears 23:08:35 volume 3 doesn't list it as a system only instruction 23:08:49 :) 23:08:50 thz a lot 23:09:18 i should to print intel documentation... 23:09:31 --- quit: trans (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23:10:04 "The CPUID instruction can be executed at any privilege level to serialize instruction execution." 23:10:13 no way, it's a thousand pages or so 23:10:17 just use a pdf viewer 23:11:38 IIRC, there's a bit in one of the control registers that is 1 if cpuid is supported, and 0 if not 23:11:58 so looking at that, you can see if you can call it 23:12:07 if you can't call it, it's a early 486 or above 23:12:29 and you have to consult feature bits in one of the control regs (crX), but I forget which one 23:13:12 geist, you can get free printed intel documentation 23:13:20 yes, I have it too 23:13:25 just answer a form in intel web 23:13:26 but you said you want to print it 23:13:34 but i cant get it 23:13:38 right 23:13:44 I just use the pdf viewer nowadays 23:13:49 becaise there are no printed pdfs in stock :( 23:13:59 it's easier to search through it, my physical books are a bit old now 23:14:16 hehe 23:14:24 send me your intel books... :P 23:14:48 heh, I still use em occasionally 23:15:13 :) 23:16:22 yeah, looks like if you can set bit 21 of EFLAGS and it sticks, you can call cpuid 23:16:28 Intel labs in spain is in the same building than my job office 23:16:28 X) 23:16:50 I'm not really sure how to tell if it's earlier than 386, though I'm sure it's easy to figure out 23:17:03 sure 23:17:11 im looking for :) 23:17:11 without doing something illegal for 286 and catching the GP exception 23:17:18 I'm kind of curious now 23:17:22 :P 23:17:35 though I haven't seen a 286 in years now 23:19:09 ah ha 23:19:13 look in volume 1 23:19:19 "basic architecture" 23:19:33 chapter 13: Processor Identification and Feature Determination 23:19:56 tells you how to precisely figure out the earlier ones 23:19:59 looking 23:20:19 8086 processor — Bits 12 through 15 of the EFLAGS register are always set. 23:20:20 • Intel 286 processor — Bits 12 through 15 are always clear in real-address mode. 23:20:20 • 32-bit processors — In real-address mode, bit 15 is always clear and bits 12 through 14 23:20:20 have the last value loaded into them. In protected mode, bit 15 is always clear, bit 14 has 23:20:20 the last value loaded into it, and the IOPL bits depends on the current privilege level 23:20:20 (CPL). The IOPL field can be changed only if the CPL is 0. 23:20:37 for the EFLAGS register 23:22:55 yes... i've just readed it 23:22:58 thz a lot :) 23:23:05 no problem 23:23:25 there is lots and lots of stuff in those manuals, just reading through the table of contents pretty much points you to this stuff 23:23:45 as much as I've hear people bitch about those manuals, they kick every other cpu's manuals ass 23:25:48 * do is away: at Moscow ... bbl 23:25:52 --- nick: do -> do[done] 23:26:46 yes, i know :) 23:27:01 geist, did you code some os? 23:27:24 ops... bad english... 23:27:26 xD 23:27:28 sure 23:27:32 http://newos.sf.net/ 23:27:43 mostly just a kernel, but I'm mostly into kernel stuff 23:27:53 :) 23:28:23 im trying to do a very small 32bits and protected mode kernel 23:28:54 with comments in spanish languaje 23:29:10 hmm 23:48:02 geist 23:48:23 do you know why linux uses two NULL GDT entries? 23:48:28 nope 23:48:30 optimization? 23:48:32 ok... 23:50:42 I know very little about linux's internals 23:51:12 aja... 23:51:24 do you use newos usualy? 23:52:23 for what? 23:53:15 for to general purposes 23:53:21 it's just a kernel 23:53:40 yes... but can you use some apps over it 23:53:49 isn't it? 23:53:59 sure 23:54:06 someone has to write em though 23:54:15 :) 23:55:48 --- join: Mathis (~Mathis@manz-d9b9566d.pool.mediaWays.net) joined #osdev 23:56:09 hi all 23:57:19 sup Mathis 23:59:59 --- log: ended osdev/02.12.06